After doing some digging on the always reliable Yahoo Answers I can safely add that Native Americans established few permanent settlements in areas of a warmer climate (I.E New Mexico-Ohio) however Vikings also had established settlements in Norway at the time. It’s then possible to conclude that 1.) Nomadic people in America had some permanent settlements and that 2.) It’s possible to have an functioning permanent community in a climate such as the ice bay of Forochel. Now considering that the Lossoth are still alive could hint at some form of society/council due to the fact that if there wasn’t any then tribes would be constantly at war with each other slowly diminishing their own race. And if there were a council there would also most likely be a permanent location that they could meet in, such as where Hearth suggested. Now I’m no Anthropologist and this is all skeptical, combined with my minute knowledge of lore, I could be completely wrong in regards to the Lossoth, this is just my best guess of what their society could have possibly been like. Also the dwellings of these people resemble those built by our friends over at WesterosCraft for the wildlings so I took some pictures, just to give you guys an idea of what these tents/huts might look like in-game.
I just want to build those things that Ahorn posted tbh
Considering the climate, as well as the Native American influences, I reckon that the Lossoth may have used saunas/sweat lodges. The Miwok people here in northern California, for instance, purified themselves in sweat lodges before and after hunts as a ritual of sorts.
Cultures are nomadic mostly due to the availability and location of food. It is not until the invention of agriculture that cultures truly developed permanent settlements. With that said most nomadic cultures move in a cyclical pattern so they would revisit the same areas once a year. I agree there could be a meeting area that has more permanent structures.
True, however whether they have an place with permanent structures that serves as meeting point depends on how many tribes there are and how big they are. This is important for how long they stay there every year (since they need food for the people and how long meeting\concil would take) and thus for whether they have permanent houses or not.
After rereading the Silmarillion appendix I can say that the form ‘los’ in ‘Lossoth’, means snow. Another argument Tolkien would have imagined snow in the Icebay. Oh and the more obvious one is that they were referred to as the Snowmen… Something else interesting I found in Appendix A in the LotR is they had sledges.
We’ve already covered this issue. Given Forochel’s latitude it would make no sense for it to have year-round snow. They would house in the snow in the winter, but during the summer the snow would melt and they’d have tents - just like many indigenous Arctic groups around the world.
edit: Your argument is akin to saying that the Misty Mountains must have had permnanent mist.
Please pardon me for Again discussing the Lossoth people, I really don’t try being annoying, but I must say I found a very important paragraph far in the back of the LotR concerning these Forodwaith… It pretty much explains everything concerning the climate -‘it is very cold up there because the cold of Morgoth’s realm Still lives there, even though it’s only 300 miles north of the Shire’- and their way of living -‘they live in snow and they’re used to the bitter cold and they live mostly in the big northwestern Cape of Forochel, but they camp often on the southern shores of the bay at the foot of the mountains’- and some other stuff: ‘they can run with bones at their feet and they have carts without wheels’. This can be found in the very last ‘chapter’ of the books, called Notes. It is note 22. at page 1400 in my edition. Plz no hate.
What do you think this actually contributes to the discussion? Your quote (these are not direct quotes by the way) literally states that they camp. That means they have tents.
And nobody is saying that they don’t ever live in snow and build igloos, just not at the time the map is set.
edit: Another quote:
‘But the winter was long in loosing its grip that year; and though it was then March, the ice was only beginning to break.’
This tells us two things:
- That the ice melts in the Icebay of Forochel, and
- That March was considered a late time for that to happen.
Watch this video, and pay close attention to Hudson Bay:
Notice how the snow melts on the land before the sea ice melts? Also notice how it takes until June for that to happen? If the sea ice melts in March on average in the Icebay, we’re looking at a climate closer to that of mid to northern Scandinavia, which would undoubtedly be cooler in September but which would not have experienced snowfall during the summer.
It explains that it is unnaturally cold, because of Morgoth’s realm of the past. Despite its location; only 300 miles north of the Shire.
Yes. 300 miles north of the Shire - if we are to place the Shire in southern England - is Scotland. When I said: “we’re looking at a climate closer to that of mid to northern Scandinavia” that would literally not be possible without some magical intervention.
Arnor is now officially in progress!
I will be making a general style guide for Annuminas and for Arnor as a whole today, as to help encourage builders to give Arnorian ruins a try. Expect to see it later this evening. Cheers!
Do /warp ArnorGuide to see the style guide!
Quick comment on the various Arnor towns/fort. I think it would be a good idea to decide when and how each village was ruined, so the person who builds the town/fort can make a decision on how destroyed their project will be. Essentially, establish a little bit of lore about each place to create a sense of immersion and consistency.
Hi all,
I made some names in Sindarin for the Arnor towns:
Town 1: Ornduirro = tree Banks since it is placed near a river with plenty of trees
Town 2: Gwaeryn which means windy grove due to much trees again
Town 3: Athradamen= crossroads since it was a large trade town
Town 4: Maethoriach which means warrior’s ford because it was near the border between rhudaur and arthedain so there would have been a military presence there
Town 5: Amon-Garth which means fortified hill since there is a protected area in the centre of the town.
I will make soon some names for the forts.
Regards - creepy